我们的生态城市（二）How do we become an ecocity?（2）

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我们的生态城市（二）How do we become an ecocity?（2）

DR ANDI HORVATH 
So we've got to take - be cool, literally. Alright, so we can fix our buses by giving them different fuels, we can fix our buildings. What else is on your to-do list? I'm making you emperor of Australia. 

DR SEONA CANDY  
I definitely want to see more green spaces. Because that - it helps with a general wellbeing to have green spaces rather than just all concrete. Aside from that, it helps with this urban heat island effect because it's one of these areas in a city that's not going to store all that heat that's going to make it really, really hot. It's also really great for stormwater management. Green space, green area or permeable paving or whatever kind of water sensitive urban design features you put, it's a - rain events are going to become shorter and sharper and so we're going to have a lot of water to deal with. Anyone who's been down the end of Elizabeth Street, near Flinders Street station in Melbourne, has seen what it looks like when there's a serious rainfall event because there's knee-deep water. Because that's actually - Elizabeth Street used to be a river before it was a street. So this is why the natural environment is saying, well actually, no, I'm going to do what I want. 

So this is where, like in this park that we're sitting in now, Lincoln Square, the City of Melbourne has actually put in stormwater tanks underneath the park. So this is a way of stormwater storage to stop the problem happening down the bottom of Elizabeth Street. But also storing that water so that when it's the middle of summer and they want to water this lovely green grass that we're surrounded by, they can do it.

DR ANDI HORVATH 
Obviously retrofitting is a way to go with existing buildings. But what about design of new buildings or these so-called over-designed buildings that you referred to earlier?

DR SEONA CANDY  
Yes, look, I think in the past they didn't have the sophisticated kind of analysis techniques that we have now. So they'd put in a large sort of safety factor I suppose in the building of buildings. So they'd put the bricks together and they'd make sure that that held the roof. But they erred on the side of caution and put more material into the building, which makes it stronger but I suppose less efficient when you're building it. So now our newer buildings are more efficiently designed with less materials. But, as a result, they're not strong enough to hold a rooftop garden. But I mean there are rooftop gardens on newer buildings. So there's one on the new Cancer Centre on Royal Parade. There's ways you can do it without putting loads of soil and causing your building to crumble. 

DR ANDI HORVATH 
So next time we look at a city from a distance or a high-rise flat, what do you want us to think about?

DR SEONA CANDY  
I want people to think about how they could be different. You know I want people to think about, oh what might that look like with greenery on the roof, what might it feel like inside? There's some amazing - there's actually green roof projects in Balaclava in Melbourne. There was a community, an apartment block, one of these older buildings who put a green roof. It's amazing, it's a beautiful space. I want them to see not just the challenges, I want them to see the opportunities. I think one of the common misconceptions around the area of sustainability and resilience and environmental impact is everyone thinks the changes that we have to make are going to be bad. Whereas I see the changes are going to be really - could be really good if we do them right. I see them as opportunities. An ecocity, a future city, is I think going to be better than what we've already got.

DR ANDI HORVATH 
We need to get away from this helicopter, it's following us, I'm innocent. Seona, you mentioned social dimensions. Do you mean connecting us more together as humans and community?

DR SEONA CANDY  
We have an amazing culture in our cities and we don't want to lose that. So whatever technological changes we make for the - so we can maintain our environment, we also need to maintain our culture at the same time.

DR ANDI HORVATH 
What are some of the misconceptions in the public that people have about sustainable or resilient cities?

DR SEONA CANDY  
Look, I think people are scared of change in general. But I think they also assume that any changes we're going to make for the good of the environment are going to be bad for the people living in it. Which, to me, it doesn't have to be that way. I see actually the changes we can make will make our city better, a better place to live. I don't know if any of you have seen that cartoon where there's a guy standing up going, oh we'll have clean energy, we'll have water, we'll have blah, blah, blah. Then someone - they talk about taking action on climate change and someone puts up his hand and says, what if it's all a hoax and we create a better world for nothing? It's that kind of thing. All the changes we would make to make our city more sustainable and resilient will also just actually make it a better place. They'll make it a better place if we bring the community along with it. Like I said earlier, you can't just dump a technology in an area, particularly not in a city which already has such a strong culture. You've got to co-design solutions with the people who live in the city. 

DR ANDI HORVATH 
Now if you're wondering what that funny noise is, we're kicking leaves here in another park. We've just wandered over to Argyle Park here in the city of Melbourne. Seona I'm really glad that you're in charge of the future. I've made you emperor of Australia. What's the first thing you want us to get going on?

DR SEONA CANDY  
I think the first thing we've got to get going on - well kind of two parallel things - we've got to get people on board, we've got to get the buy-in to make changes in a city. Because a city is not just about its infrastructure or its technology, it's about its people. So that's about I suppose getting people on board and showing them that change is for good, not for bad. Highlight all the opportunities and really support and nurture these seeds of change that I mentioned earlier, the seeds that could lead to a better future. So it's community building exercises, but it's also - it's things where people are testing out urban biogas, are they putting it in to power buses, it's food waste initiatives where there's community composting. All sorts of things, these seeds of change. 

This new - the Singapore bike share, the Singapore company that's starting that new bike share. What's it called? The oBike or something like that. That's a new initiative, it's a new seed of change. It's going to improve walkability, active transport in the city. So I suppose we've got to look at those seeds and look at them and analyse them and nurture the ones that we think are really going to bring positive change. 

DR ANDI HORVATH 
You started off life as an engineer, a systems engineer. What good advice were you given by various mentors, or perhaps a book or a film? Also I want to find out what good advice you give to your students. So let's start with you, the early Seona Candy.

DR SEONA CANDY  
Look, I think I was a woman in a male-dominated profession. Early on I remember people saying to me, oh why are you working in that field, you're never going to get a job. Then some wise person - I can't remember who it was - said to me, well, yeah, but if you're doing something you really believe in and you really like, then you're probably going to be quite good at it and then you're probably going to get a job. That's the kind of thing, it's sort of don't let people stop you in your tracks. Everyone - that there are limitations, absolutely, to what - not everyone can do everything. But that's the kind of thing, go well don't let that put you off just yet. Another thing would be to get out of your comfort zone. So I think I did that a lot. Again, not everyone can do it to the extent that I did it by going into the Himalayas in Nepal or Lake Tonle Sap in Cambodia. But I think you can take a couple of risks here and there, get out of your comfort zone, try new things and that's the way you learn and grow.

This is where this, again, links back to this seeds of change thing. There's a whole movement in academia about the experimental city. Where we actually, instead of just sitting back and going, we're not going to do that because it's not going to work, we actually have to try it. We actually have to try it on a small scale and look at how - and if it works, that's the way we learn. Even if it doesn't work, that's the way we learn. We learn what does and what doesn't work. Then we look, if it works, okay let's scale it up, let's change it, let's improve it, let's spread it across the city. So it's that experimentation that I think is going to be really important. We need to take a couple of risks.

DR ANDI HORVATH 
So that's your advice to students really, experiment, take some risks and learn from it.

DR SEONA CANDY  
Look, it's my advice to anyone who lives in a city or the people who are making decisions in a city. Try things on a small scale, see if they work, because that builds community, that brings people together to join the conversation around ecocities. Even if the thing you're trying out doesn't work, that builds resilience because you're building adaptive capacity in your city.

DR ANDI HORVATH 
Now you spoke about Australia having one of the highest energy uses. What is it with Australia, what's going on?

DR SEONA CANDY  
Well, it's probably more around that we have one of the highest emissions per capita. So overall our emissions footprint isn't huge, but per capita it's quite large. Part of that is that we have a very high-carbon lifestyle, so lots of car transport, we've got lots of fossil fuel energy, all that kind of thing. If we're going to I suppose change our cities for the better, we've got to look at what's going to reduce the carbon footprint of its citizens, and that takes good urban planning. 

CHRIS HATZIS 
Excellent advice, Seona. Think small. Small footprint. Lay off the carbon. All good stuff. That way we can become happy and healthy citizens in our resilient cities. Thanks to Dr Seona Candy, academic at Architecture, Building and Planning at the University of Melbourne. And thanks to our reporter Dr Andi Horvath. Eavesdrop on Experts - stories of inspiration and insights - is a production of the University of Melbourne, Australia. This episode was recorded on the 20th of June 2017. You'll find a full transcript on the Pursuit website. Audio engineering by Arch Cuthbertson, co-production by Andi Horvath, Chris Hatzis and Claudia Hooper. Thanks also to Belinda Young. And check out the Ecocity World Summit 2017 website. Still curious about the world? I hope you are. Nip on over to our sister podcast, Up Close, which features in-depth and long-form conversations with seasoned researchers across many fields. 
I’m Chris Hatzis, producer and editor. Join me again next time for another Eavesdrop On Experts.

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