【英文翻译版100】迈克尔·多布森：《哈姆雷特》

英文文稿+中文翻译

Zachary Davis: William Shakespeare is the greatest writer in history, and Hamlet is his greatest work.

扎克里·戴维斯：威廉·莎士比亚是历史上最伟大的作家，而《哈姆雷特》是他最伟大的代表作。

Michael Dobson: It’s a play about, or it can be a play about adolescence, a play about identity, a play in which you encounter somebody whose main purpose seems to be to think, and to try and talk about, what am I to do next? Where am I? What's what's happening? What do you think I should do? 

迈克尔·多布森：可以说，这是一部关于青春期的戏剧，一部关于身份的戏剧。你在这部戏剧中遇到的角色，主要目的似乎是思考、尝试并谈论我接下来该做什么？我在哪里？发生了什么事？你认为我应该做什么？

Michael Dobson: My name is Professor Michael Dobson, I'm the director of the Shakespeare Institute in Stratford-upon-Avon, which is the only university research department entirely dedicated to Shakespeare, other playwrights from Shakespeare's time, Shakespeare's culture, Shakespeare's effects in the world, and it's the sort of academic collaborator and think tank for the Royal Shakespeare Company.

迈克尔·多布森：我是迈克尔·多布森教授，是莎士比亚研究所所长，我们的研究所坐落于埃文河畔斯特拉特福，是唯一一家专注于研究莎士比亚、莎士比亚时期其他剧作家、莎士比亚文化和莎士比亚在世界范围内影响的大学研究机构。我们也是皇家莎士比亚剧团的学术合作方和智库。

Zachary Davis: In Hamlet, Shakespeare gave us one of the first modern characters in literature. We are invited into the mind of Hamlet, to see how he thinks and acts in the face of love, grief, and revenge. 

扎克里·戴维斯：在《哈姆雷特》中，莎士比亚塑造了文学史上第一个现代化角色。他向我们展示了哈姆雷特的内心世界，他是如何思考的以及面对爱情、悲伤和复仇情绪。

Michael Dobson:Its structure is rather simple. We meet a man who is told by his father's ghost that his father was murdered by his uncle. His uncle is unfortunately now king and has all the security apparatus of the state at his disposal. His father's ghost thinks that Hamlet should kill the king and avenge him. It's not an easy situation, and what that situation does is produce a protagonist who knows more than the other people on stage, and he shares that knowledge with the audience.

迈克尔·多布森：整部书的结构相当简单。我们所看见的书中主角，通过他父亲的鬼魂得知，父亲其实是被叔叔杀害的。不幸的是，他的叔叔现在是国王，整个国家所有的安全设施都供他使用。他父亲的鬼魂认为，哈姆雷特应该杀死国王，为自己报仇。这不是一个简单的桥段，而这个桥段里塑造的主角，比舞台上的其他人知道得更多，他与观众分享了这些额外的信息。

Michael Dobson: We have a tremendously intimate narrative relationship with Hamlet because there's nothing hidden from us. The audience’s consciousness, and the protagonist’s consciousness are pretty much aligned throughout the play. And underlying it all is our knowledge that this is a tragedy and it's not going to end well. And Hamlet is very, very conscious of the fact that he's mortal. It's one of the things he keeps coming back to. He knows he's going to die. 

迈克尔·多布森：观众与哈姆雷特有一种极其亲密的叙事关系，因为观众知晓一切。观众的意识和主人公的意识在整部剧中几乎是一致的。而这一切的前提是我们知道这是一部悲剧。哈姆雷特非常清晰地认识到自己是个普通人。这是他不断回想的事情之一，他知道自己终将死去。

Michael Dobson:He's unlike lots of other characters in drama who are getting on with life, and then something dreadful happens and it stops. Hamlet knows. 

迈克尔·多布森：他和这部戏中的许多其他角色不同。其他角色的生活因发生某些可怕事件戛然而止，但哈姆雷特知道这一切。

Zachary Davis: Welcome to Writ Large, a podcast about how books change the world. I’m Zachary Davis. For this episode, I sat down with professor Michael Dobson to discuss William Shakespeare’s Hamlet.

扎克里·戴维斯：欢迎收听：改变你和世界的100书，在这里我们为大家讲述改变世界的书籍。我是扎卡里·戴维斯。每一集，我都会和一位世界顶尖学者讨论一本影响历史进程的书。在本集，我将和迈克尔·多布森教授一起讨论威廉·莎士比亚的《哈姆雷特》。

Zachary Davis: Could you tell us the major milestones of Shakespeare’s life?

扎克里·戴维斯：能请您向我们介绍一下莎士比亚生平的主要事件吗？

Michael Dobson: He's born to a fairly upwardly mobile family in Stratford-upon-Avon, which is an important market town in the Midlands on major transport routes and a town that's visited quite regularly by touring theatre companies. His father, as an alderman and a bailiff, had the job of vetting theatre companies when they came through town when Shakespeare was young. So Shakespeare would have had privileged access to that. 

迈克尔·多布森：莎士比亚出生在埃文河畔斯特拉特福，出生在一个向上流动的家庭。埃文河畔斯特拉特福是中部地区重要的城镇，位于交通要道上，经常有巡回演出的剧团访问。他的父亲是一位市议员也是一名地方官，在莎士比亚年轻时，他的父亲就负责审核剧团访问。因此莎士比亚在这方面享有便利。

Michael Dobson: He went to the local grammar school, again as a result of his father's civic privilege, which meant he was taught Latin drama, which was quite a big part of the humanist syllabus in those days. And he married a local girl, Anne Hathaway. They have a daughter. Shakespeare still seems to be based in Stratford, despite evidently having shown literary promise at school. Then they have twins, and then Shakespeare disappears. And the next time you see him, he's in London. 

迈克尔·多布森：莎士比亚就读于当地一所文法学校，还是因为父亲公职人员身份带来的特权，他接受的是拉丁戏剧的教学，这是当时人文主义教学大纲中相当重要的一部分。他娶了一个当地姑娘，名叫安妮·海瑟薇。他们育有一个女儿。尽管莎士比亚已经在学校里展现出对文学的追求，但他依旧在斯特拉特福生活工作。在生育了一对双胞胎后，莎士比亚消失了，当他再次出现在公众视野中时，他已经搬到了伦敦。

Zachary Davis: This period between 1585 and 1592 is sometimes called Shakespeare’s “lost years.” We don’t have a ton of information on what he was up to. Most of what we do know about this period of his life comes in the form of legend. One story suggests that he was lying low after illegally poaching deer on a local Squire’s estate. But it could’ve also been that he was just really busy with his new family and trying to establish himself as a writer.  

扎克里·戴维斯：1585年至1592年被称为莎士比亚“消失的岁月”。我们不太知道他当时在忙什么。对他这段时期生活的大部分认知都是来源于传说。有一种说法是，他在当地一位地主的庄园里非法偷猎鹿之后刻意保持低调。但也有可能是，他真的忙着照顾自己的家庭，忙于成为一名作家。

Michael Dobson: This makes a certain amount of sense. If you're an aspiring writer, if you want to get on with your career as a writer, being in a house with very newborn twins, it's not ideal, and I speak from personal experience. But in any case, Shakespeare next turns up, he's next mentioned as an actor who is also an aspiring and versatile playwright. He's criticized in a pamphlet attributed to Robert Green, saying, “Be careful of this upstart. He thinks he's the only ‘Shake-scene’ in the country.” 

迈克尔·多布森：这在一定程度上是合理的。根据我的个人经验，如果你是一位有抱负的作家，希望继续你的写作生涯，那么和双胞胎新生儿呆在一个房子里并不理想。但无论如何，莎士比亚再次出现在公众视野、再次被提到时，不单单是一名演员，也是一名有追求的、多才多艺的剧作家。罗伯特·格林写的小册子中对莎士比亚提出批评，他说道：“要小心这个新秀。他认为自己是这个国家唯一一位可以震撼舞台的人。"

Michael Dobson: And from then on, he's then writing pretty fast, clearly acting, and we don't quite know which companies is acting with, but we can tell some of the plays he'd acted in because he echoes them in such detail in his own. There's an outbreak of plague which shuts the theatres in 1593. He is supported by an aristocrat, the Earl of Southampton, and is able to have a kind of writing grant. And he writes two non dramatic poems “Venus and Adonis” and “Lucrece”. And “Venus and Adonis” is a huge hit. It's Shakespeare's biggest printed book in his own lifetime. Everybody loves it. It's sort of playful, compassionate, soft porn. Most of it consists of a very eloquent goddess begging for sex and not getting it just in every possible way that a good Elizabethan grammar school goddess would use rhetoric to beg for sex. She begs for sex. It's an immensely charming poem. 

迈克尔·多布森：自那以后，莎士比亚写作速度非常快。他显然也在剧团参演，我们不知道他在哪个剧团演出，但我们知道他演出的一些剧目，因为他在自己创作的戏剧中也细致地呼应了那些剧目。1593年瘟疫爆发，剧院被迫关闭。莎士比亚获得了南安普顿伯爵的资助，可以得到一定的写作补助。他创作了两首非戏剧性的诗歌《维纳斯和阿多尼斯》以及《鲁克丽丝受辱记》。《维纳斯和阿多尼斯》大获成功，是莎士比亚最叫座的作品。每一个人都喜欢这部作品。它是一部俏皮的、富有同情心的、略带软色情的作品。这部作品中的大部分内容是一位极富语言表现力的女神在乞求性爱而不得。她用尽了伊丽莎白时代文法学校可能教授的所有修辞，来乞求性爱。这是一首非常迷人的诗。

Zachary Davis: The success of this poem helped Shakespeare establish his name as a talented up and coming writer in London. This put him in a good position once the theatres reopened after the plague.

扎克里·戴维斯：这首诗的成功帮助莎士比亚建立了自己的名声，一位才华洋溢的新秀伦敦作家。这也帮助他在疫情之后、剧院重开之时获得了一定的优势。

Michael Dobson: Shakespeare is in a position to be taken on by the Lord Chamberlain's Mmen, who are who are big company, as a shareholder and as their lead scriptwriter. He could have just stayed as a poet. Or he could have gone back just to writing plays. But in fact, he goes back and he does both at once. He writes highly poetic plays for a team of actors who will now put on his scripts reliably as he wants them. And that's the career position that he then holds and maintains. 

迈克尔·多布森：莎士比亚当时被邀请加入宫务大臣剧团成为股东和首席编剧，这是当时的一个大公司。他本可以继续只做一个诗人，或者他可以只写剧本。但事实上，他回去后同时做了这两件事，他为演员团队写了极富诗意的剧本，这些演员按照要求演出剧本。这就是他之后一直保持的职业定位。

Michael Dobson: He invests more and more money back in Stratford. When he signs legal documents in London he always describes himself as William Shakespeare of Stratford-upon-Avon in the county of Warwick. He commutes back to his family periodically. But he's a conspicuous literary and theatrical celebrity and that company, The Lord Chamberlain's Mmen, just after Hamlet is written and is such a huge success when King James I does inherit the throne from Scotland, Shakespeare's company become The King's Men. They become the official providers of entertainment at holiday times for the monarchy, as well as continuing to own their own theatre, The Globe on bank side and then their second posher theatre, the Blackfriars, on the other side of the Thames. 

迈克尔·多布森：莎士比亚逐渐加大在斯特拉特福的投资。他在伦敦签署法律文件时，他总是自称沃里克郡埃文河畔斯特拉特福的威廉·莎士比亚，他也会定期回家。但莎士比亚是一位引人注目的文学和戏剧名人，《哈姆雷特》出版并大获成功，当国王詹姆斯一世继承苏格兰王位时，莎士比亚的公司宫务大臣剧团改名为国王剧团。他们成为皇室假日期间官方的休闲娱乐供应商，同时也继续运营着自己的剧院——班克赛德地区的环球剧院和位于泰晤士河另一边、更豪华的布莱克弗里亚尔剧院。

Michael Dobson: So he's a very prosperous, major show business celebrity. He's one of the few people in that boom in Elizabethan popular drama who, actually, money sticks to. And in Shakespeare's case, he invests a lot of it in buying an enormous house in Stratford, new place, right in the middle of town in 1596 and then buying securities by buying shares in the tithes, which is a brilliant investment game where you kind of pretty much bought shares in the church. 

迈克尔·多布森：所以莎士比亚是一位非常富有的演艺界核心名人。他是伊丽莎白时期流行戏剧的大繁荣中，为数不多能够吸金的人。莎士比亚在1596年，一掷千金，在斯特拉特福镇中心购置了一栋大宅作为全新的居所。他也通过购买什一税股份的方式进行权益投资，这是一项绝佳的投资，相当于是在教堂里买了股份。

Michael Dobson: And his son dies, but his daughters grow up. And when his daughters are, around about the time his daughters are marrying, Shakespeare seems to be spending a bit more time back in Stratford.

迈克尔·多布森：莎士比亚的儿子不幸离世，但他的女儿们都长大成人了。当他的女儿们差不多到了谈婚论嫁的年纪，莎士比亚呆在斯特拉特福的时间似乎更多了。

Zachary Davis: In 1613, during a performance of Henry VIII, a prop cannon misfired and set the Globe Theatre on fire, burning it to the ground. By this point, Shakespeare had stopped writing, and distanced himself from his theatre company and the theatre scene in London.  

扎克里·戴维斯：1613年，在《亨利八世》的一场演出中，一门道具大炮失火，将环球剧院烧成了废墟。此时，莎士比亚已经停止写作，并与他的剧团和伦敦的戏剧界保持距离。 

Michael Dobson: After the Globe burns down, he's not involved in the rebuilding of the Globe, which the company does. He hands over as chief scriptwriter to John Fletcher, who is more or less his apprentice and seems to be spending much more of his time back here in Stratford, where he dies duly in 1616, quite young, 52, and is duly buried in the same church where he was baptized, the very grand and rather beautiful Holy Trinity Church in Stratford, and he's given a monument that compares him to Virgil and to Nestor in Latin and a funerary bust, which dresses him in a gown to mark the fact that he was learned literally, that he's an intellectual. 

迈克尔·多布森：环球剧院被烧毁后，莎士比亚没有参与重建工作，但他的公司参与其中。他将首席编剧的工作交棒给了学徒约翰·弗莱彻。莎士比亚似乎有更多的时间呆在斯特拉特福。莎士比亚于1616年，在斯特拉特福逝世，年仅52岁。他也被埋葬在他受洗的教堂，非常宏伟和漂亮的斯特拉特福圣三一教堂。他拥有一座纪念碑，用拉丁文将他与维吉尔和内斯特相提并论，还有一座半身像，身着长袍，标志着他是博学的知识分子。

Zachary Davis: What was Shakespeare's kind of total body of work? How many plays and poetry did he publish? 

扎克里·戴维斯：莎士比亚的作品整体是怎样的？他一共发表了多少戏剧和诗歌？

Michael Dobson: 18 of his plays came out in his lifetime. If you include some of the stuff he wrote collaboratively, Edward III, he wrote quite a big chunk of. There's 36 plays in the volume put out by Heming and Condell, his surviving friends, and Burbage was helping, but Burbage died before the book came out. And then there's Pericles, which he co-wrote with Wilkins, which didn't get into that volume. 

迈克尔·多布森：他一生中共出版了18部戏剧。但算上他与人合作写的内容，比如《爱德华三世》，他写了其中相当大的一部分，海明和康德尔出版的合集就囊括了36部戏剧。康德尔是莎士比亚的朋友，伯奇也有帮忙，但在合集出版前就离世了。还有莎士比亚与威尔金斯合写的《伯里克利》，没有被收入该合集。

Michael Dobson: So by Elizabethan standards, it’s not that many.  You know, there's about 38, 39 plays, and then there's the volume of sonnets and, “Lucrece” and  “Venus and Adonis” and a very cryptic and rather beautiful little poem called “The Phoenix and the Turtle”, which he writes for a rather courtly volume when the fashion for metaphysical poetry is just coming in, in the early 17th century. He was busy, and you can see why he might want to take the last three years of his life off.

迈克尔·多布森：按伊丽莎白时期的标准来看，他的作品不算多，大概有三十八九部戏剧，有一卷十四行诗，有《鲁克丽丝受辱记》以及《维纳斯和阿多尼斯》，还有一首神秘但精美的小诗《凤凰和斑鸠》。这首小诗创作于17世纪初，是形而上学诗歌刚刚流行时，莎士比亚为宫廷创作的。他一直都很忙碌，这样你就可以理解，为什么他很想在生命的最后三年里休息一下。

Zachary Davis: So moving to the play, could you give us a plot summary of what happens in Hamlet?

扎克里·戴维斯：说回这部戏，您能介绍一下《哈姆雷特》中的大致情节吗？

Michael Dobson: It's very important that Hamlet starts with some anxious sentries on a cold night. We gather they've seen a ghost. They have brought a student who they know called Horatio in case the ghost turns up again to prove to him that they've seen a ghost because they think he might know what to do about it. The ghost indeed turns up, and it looks exactly like the late king, the recently died, dead old king Hamlet, who was a great warrior and who fought for territory against the Norwegians, led by old Fortinbras. 

迈克尔·多布森：《哈姆雷特》以寒夜里焦急的哨兵开篇。我们推断他们看到了一个鬼魂。他们带着一位叫作霍拉旭的学生，当鬼魂再次出现时可以向他证明他们看到了鬼魂，因为他们认为霍拉旭可能知道该如何应对鬼魂。鬼魂确实出现了，它看起来就是先王的样子，也就是刚离世的老国王哈姆雷特。老国王是一个伟大的战士，他为了保卫领土，与老福丁布拉斯领导的挪威人作战。

Michael Dobson: And Horatio says, “I better tell Prince Hamlet about this. This is the ghost of his father. I mean, if the ghost is going to talk to anybody it is going to talk to him.” 

迈克尔·多布森：霍拉旭说道，“我最好告诉哈姆雷特王子，这是他父亲的鬼魂。如果这个鬼魂想要和人类对话，那应该是和哈姆雷特王子。”

Michael Dobson: We cut to the court where Hamlet is in complete silence wearing black. He's the only figure in the court who is still in mourning. 

迈克尔·多布森：镜头切到宫廷，哈姆雷特身着黑衫，沉默不语，他是宫廷中唯一还在服丧的人。

Zachary Davis: Hamlet’s uncle, Claudius, is giving a speech to the court. He says that although the king’s death is tragic, it’s time to move on. He will assume the throne and marry Gertrude, his dead brother’s widow and prince Hamlet’s mother.  

扎克里·戴维斯：哈姆雷特的叔叔克劳狄斯正在宫廷发表演说。他说尽管老国王的离世是个悲剧，也是时候往前看了。他将继承王位，娶亡兄的遗孀即哈姆雷特王子的母亲葛簇特为妻。

Michael Dobson: All our attention is focused on Hamlet because we know there's a ghost who wants to talk to him, and he's clearly not happy with the situation of his mother having just married his uncle.

迈克尔·多布森：观众的注意力都集中在哈姆雷特身上，因为我们知道有一个鬼魂希望与他对话，哈姆雷特显然很不满他的母亲与叔叔结婚。

Michael Dobson: And suddenly Hamlet is left on his own at the end of this scene. He's forbidden to go back to university, he's studying in Wittenberg in Germany. Horatio comes, and tells him about the ghost. And when Hamlet goes to the platform with the sentries, he does indeed get spoken to by the ghost who tells him he was that although the propaganda is saying he died spontaneously of natural causes, he was actually poisoned by his uncle while asleep after lunch in his orchard. And he tells Hamlet, “Leave your mother out of this, but avenge me.”

迈克尔·多布森：而在这一幕的结尾，哈姆雷特突然就被抛弃，只剩一人了。他被禁止回到大学，他在德国的维滕贝格学习。霍拉旭找到哈姆雷特并告诉他关于鬼魂的事。当哈姆雷特和哨兵一起走上舞台时，他确实和鬼魂说上了话。鬼魂告诉他，他被宣传为自然死亡，但实际上他是在果园里吃完午饭睡觉时被他叔叔毒死的。他告诉哈姆雷特，“别把你母亲扯进来，为我报仇。”

Zachary Davis: The next scene opens in the house of a man named Polonius who is king Claudius’s right hand man. Polonius knows that Claudius killed the king, and he is helping to keep it a secret. But once Claudius starts to suspect Hamlet knows something, he and Polonius concoct a plan to find out for sure.

扎克里·戴维斯：下一幕在波洛涅斯家里展开，他是克劳狄斯国王的左右手。波洛涅斯知道克劳狄斯杀了老国王，并帮忙保守这个秘密。但当克劳狄斯开始怀疑哈姆雷特知道些什么的时候，他和波洛涅斯就构思了一个计划来确定。

Michael Dobson: They try to get Ophelia to sort of lie in wait for Hamlet while they spy on them and listen to find out what Hamlet may or may not know that he may or may not betray in his conversation with Ophelia. Hamlet betrays nothing. He's just really horrible to Ophelia.

迈克尔·多布森：他们试图将波洛涅斯的女儿奥菲莉娅安插在哈姆雷特身边，而他们则监视哈姆雷特和奥菲莉娅的一举一动，通过监听他们的对话，试图找出哈姆雷特知道些什么以及他是否会泄密。哈姆雷特没有泄露任何机密，只对奥菲莉娅展现出一副冷漠的态度。

Zachary Davis: Hamlet, meanwhile, spins up a plan of his own. He asks some actors to perform a play that Hamlet wrote based on what he thinks happened between his uncle and his father. They perform the play in front of Claudius, who gets very agitated and storms out.

扎克里·戴维斯：与此同时，哈姆雷特也有自己的计划。哈姆雷特将自己认为的父亲和叔叔之间发生的故事写成剧本，并邀请了一班演员出演。他们在克劳狄斯面前表演这出戏，克劳狄斯非常激动，冲了出去。

Michael Dobson: Hamlet is summoned to talk with his mother, who is not pleased with his behavior at all, as who would be? On his way to see his mother, Hamlet finds his uncle praying, his uncle is praying for forgiveness and confesses to the audience that he did indeed kill old Hamlet. So the ghost's word is confirmed for us. And Hamlet creeps up behind him and is about to kill him, but then says, ”No, hang on, he's praying. If I kill him now, he'll go straight to heaven. Where's the fun in that? That's not revenge. Well, I’ll deal with him later.” And so he leaves him and Claudius then says, “Well, I'm not succeeding in praying at all. You know, I do want repent of the crime, but I'm not confessing and I'm not giving back the Crown or Gertrude the Queen.” 

迈克尔·多布森：哈姆雷特被召去和母亲对话，他的母亲对他的行为一点也不满意，又有谁会满意呢？在去见母亲的路上，哈姆雷特发现叔叔在祈祷，他向观众承认的确是自己杀了老哈姆雷特并乞祈求宽恕。鬼魂的话得到了应证。哈姆雷特蹑手蹑脚地走到叔叔身后，准备杀了他，但转眼又说道：“不，等一下，他正在祈祷。如果我现在杀了他，他就会直接上天堂。这有什么好玩的？这不是复仇。好吧，我以后再来对付他。”于是他离开了。克劳狄斯接着说道：“我的祈祷一点也不成功。我确实想对犯罪感到后悔，但我不会承认，也不会把王位或葛簇特皇后还回去。”

Zachary Davis: Hamlet is still intent on killing Claudius, so he tries again. But instead, he accidentally kills Polonius. When Claudius hears about Polonius’s death, he realizes it’s not safe to have Hamlet around.

扎克里·戴维斯：哈姆雷特还是想杀死克劳狄斯，所以他再次尝试。但他却意外杀死了波洛涅斯。克劳狄斯听闻波洛涅斯死讯时，他意识到让哈姆雷特留在身边并不安全。

Michael Dobson: He decides that he's going to send Hamlet to England with a sealed letter that's carried by Hamlet's old fellow students, Rosencrantz and Guildenstern, which is going to tell the English authorities that on receipt of the letter, they're to kill Hamlet for him. And Hamlet is duly packed off to England with Rosencrantz and Guildenstern. 

迈克尔·多布森：克劳狄斯决心将哈姆雷特送去英格兰，哈姆雷特的两位老同学罗森格兰茨和吉尔登斯顿将与他同行，他们还携带一封密信，是为了告诉英格兰政府杀死哈姆雷特。就这样，哈姆雷特和罗森格兰茨、吉尔登斯顿一起去了英格兰。

Michael Dobson: Meanwhile, Ophelia learning that Hamlet has killed her father, goes out of her mind. And her brother Laertes arrives back from Paris, wanting to avenge all this, wanting to avenge his father confronts the king, and the king says, “Look, it wasn't me, mate, it was Hamlet.” 

迈克尔·多布森：与此同时，奥菲莉娅得知哈姆雷特杀死了她的父亲，精神失常了。而她的哥哥雷欧提斯从巴黎回来，想为这一切复仇，他与国王对峙，国王说：“看，不是我，伙计，是哈姆雷特。”

Zachary Davis: So now, Hamlet’s trying to avenge his father, Laertes is trying to avenge his father, and Claudius is trying to kill Hamlet. But Claudius’s plan was not successful, and Hamlet arrives back home, safe and sound. When he does, he finds an angry Laertes, a murderous Claudius, and his girlfriend, Ophelia, dead. 

扎克里·戴维斯：哈姆雷特想为父亲复仇，雷欧提斯也想为父亲复仇，而克劳狄斯想要杀死哈姆雷特。但是克劳狄斯的计划并不成功，哈姆雷特安全回到了自己家。而当他回到家时，他面对的是愤怒的雷欧提斯，蓄意谋杀的克劳狄斯以及死去的女友奥菲莉娅。

Michael Dobson: The play finally resolves into its very messy final scene when Claudius the king, the wicked, usurping king, says, “Look Laertes, the way of sorting this out is to challenge him to a fencing match. He's very vain about his fencing, and I know you're terrific at fencing and really like it. And then will arrange that you will have a proper sword, very pointy and sharp, and he'll only have a sporting one that's blunt like they use in contests so you can kill him that way.” And Laertes says, “Look even better, we'll do that and also, I've got some great venom and I'll dip my sword in the venom and that way it'll be absolutely dead certain, will definitely kill him. ”

迈克尔·多布森：这部剧终于进入了非常混乱的最后一幕，国王克劳狄斯，这个邪恶的篡位者说道：“雷欧提斯，解决这个问题的方法是向他发起挑战，让他参加击剑比赛。他对自己的剑术非常自信，而我知道你的剑术非常棒，而且你非常喜欢击剑。我会安排一把合适的剑给你，很尖锐很锋利，而他只有一把展现体育风尚的剑，像他们在比赛中使用的那样钝，这样你就可以杀死他。”雷欧提斯回答道：“看上去这个计划更好，我们会这样做的。而且，我有一些非常厉害的毒液，我会把我的剑浸在毒液里，这样的话，这把剑绝对是致死的，我一定可以杀了他。”

Michael Dobson: So there's then this very exciting scene of this absolute grudge fencing match in front of the whole court during which Hamlet realizes what's going on.The swords get swapped around, both Laertes and Hamlet mortally wounded each other. Hamlet, meanwhile, Claudius, just to make sure it's double sure, has tried to give Hamlet a poisoned cup, and Gertrude Hamlet's mother has drunk the cupcarp instead by mistake. So she's dying. Laertes is dying. Hamlet is dying. Hamlet stabs Claudius, the wicked, usurping king at long last, and then Hamlet has a last dialogue with Horatio, while he himself is dying.

迈克尔·多布森：接下来是最激动人心的画面，宫廷里上演了一场充满怨气的击剑比赛。在比赛中，哈姆雷特意识到发生了什么。剑被调了包，雷欧提斯和哈姆雷特都受了致命伤。与此同时克劳狄斯为了确保杀死哈姆雷特，他试图递给哈姆雷特一杯毒酒，但哈姆雷特的母亲葛簇特却误饮了毒酒。葛簇特、雷欧提斯和哈姆雷特都快死了。哈姆雷特终于刺死了克劳狄斯，这位邪恶的、篡位的国王。哈姆雷特在濒死之际，和霍拉旭进行了最后的对话。

Michael Dobson: And then Fortinbras, young Fortinbras, the son of old Fortinbras, turns up with his army. The whole Danish royal family is now totally annihilated and it's going to be Norwegians taking over. And so Fortinbras says a few proper things about what a great prince he would have been, secures the castle, and tells the soldiers to fire a volley of shots in salute over the corpse of Hamlet. And that's the end. “Go bid the soldiers shoot” is the last lines.

迈克尔·多布森：然后小福丁布拉斯，老福丁布拉斯的儿子，带领着军队出现。整个丹麦王室都被击溃了，将被挪威人接管。福丁布拉斯简单谈到自己本是一个伟大的王子，他保证了城堡的安全，并告诉士兵们向哈姆雷特的尸体鸣枪以示敬意。这就是整部剧的结局了。最后一句就是“去叫士兵们开枪”。

Zachary Davis: Of all the plays to have become the number one play of all time, why this one?

扎克里·戴维斯：《哈姆雷特》成为了戏剧史上的第一名，为什么是它呢？

Michael Dobson:It seems to be more about rendering consciousness, rendering a 3D sense of what it feels like to be an individual stuck in an unsatisfactory world. It's more interested in that than it is in its own plot. But of course, it has its cake and eats it because it's also a great Scandi noir political thriller with a really good sword fight at the end and calls for a fabulous intellectual and athletic display from the performer given the task of playing Hamlet. 

迈克尔·多布森：这部戏似乎更多的是渲染意识，渲染一种立体的感觉，作为个体被困在一个他不满意的世界里是什么感觉。整部作品对这一点的描述比刻画情节本身更为关注。当然它也有自己的特色，它是一部伟大的斯堪的纳维亚黑色政治片，最后的击剑比赛非常精彩，需要扮演哈姆雷特的演员展现出惊人的智力和运动能力。

Michael Dobson: I mean, I know a number of very good actors who've played Hamlet. Sam West, whose Hamlet I saw many times because I loved it enormously he says, “Well Hamlet, you know, when I played Hamlet, it was a long Hamlet. It was four hours with two intervals.” he said. “So the first interval, I'd eat a banana so that I would have the strength to get through the central part of the play where the big soliloquies are. In the second interval, I'd eat two bananas to get me through the gravedigger scene and the sword fight.” He says, “Yeah, Hamlet, the main thing about Hamlet, it's a three banana play.” That was his description. 

迈克尔·多布森：我认识一些非常优秀的扮演哈姆雷特的演员。萨姆·韦斯特，我多次看过他的《哈姆雷特》，因为我非常喜欢他的演出，他说过：“说到《哈姆雷特》，那是一部很长的戏剧，长达四个小时，中间还有两次中场休息。所以在第一次中场休息时，我会吃一根香蕉，这样我才有力气完成整部戏中间大段独白的部分。在第二次中场休息时，我会吃两根香蕉，以完成掘墓人和剑斗的场景。《哈姆雷特》是一部三根香蕉的戏剧。”这是他对这部戏的描述。

Zachary Davis: Is Hamlet the first modern work of literature? Does it represent a new consciousness that was emerging in Europe that made subjectivity different than what had come before?

扎克里·戴维斯：《哈姆雷特》是不是文学史上第一部现代作品？它是否代表了在欧洲出现了一种新的意识，对主体性有了不同以往的新认知？

Michael Dobson: Hamlet has become associated with the story that everything changed at the Renaissance, and suddenly we were all grown up individuals who knew that the old certainties were dead. But every single work of literature ever written has convinced its readers that, Oh, here we are, modern people, the old certainties are dead. I bet they were saying that when they first heard the “Iliad” and probably “Gilgamesh”. Hamlet has certainly become associated with the idea that, oh yeah, he's modern, he's one of us and we can dismiss everything before that. But I'm a bit suspicious of it. 

迈克尔·多布森：《哈姆雷特》已经与文艺复兴时期的变革紧紧联系在了一起，我们都在忽然间长大，明白旧的确定性已经死亡。但是，有史以来的每一部文学作品都在让它的读者相信，我们是现代的人，旧的确定性已经死亡。我敢打赌，当他们第一次听说 《伊利亚特》和《吉尔伽美什》时，他们可能也是这么说的。《哈姆雷特》当然已经被刻上了这样的烙印，他是现代的人，他是我们中的一员，我们可以否定之前的一切。但我对此还是有一点怀疑。

Michael Dobson: Certainly, subsequent thinkers have used Hamlet that way, Freud being the most obvious, who says, “Well, look, here's Hamlet to prove how different modern people are to the ancient Greeks. Because in ancient Greek times, if they were thinking about mother son incest, they just wrote Oedipus Rex. Whereas you get to Shakespeare and it's all kind of camouflaged, you know, that's clearly what's really going on. But you know, that's not what they talk about the whole time. It's not what the plot talks about the whole time.” 

迈克尔·多布森： 当然，后来的思想家们也有这样利用《哈姆雷特》的，弗洛伊德就是最明显的代表，他说：“《哈姆雷特》展现了现代人与古希腊人是多么不同。因为在古希腊时期，如果他们在思考母子乱伦问题，他们就写《俄狄浦斯王》。而到了莎士比亚时期，这一切都是伪装的、真实在发生的事情。”但是你知道，这并不是他们一直在谈论的内容，这不是剧情一直在谈论的东西。

Michael Dobson: It's a highly political play for different places. I mean, we're liable to forget that, I think where we are, but it became a national allegory for Germany from the late 18th century onwards. Freiligrath has that famous poem, “Deutschland ist Hamlet!”, where Hamlet is this figure for this ineffectual nation that is failing to come into being and seize power and just not getting on with it. And the Poles are the same. When Poland is officially wiped off the map in the 19th century as far as they’re concerned, “Oh yeah, here's a young man, alienated, angry with the government, keeps putting on clever plays that upset the authorities, ought to be the successor to the great Royal Kings of the past, yeah, he's ours. He's our, he's our emblem.”

迈克尔·多布森：对很多地区而言，这是一部极富政治色彩的戏剧。因为我们所处的位置，我们很容易忽略这一点，但从18世纪末开始，《哈姆雷特》就成为了德国的民族寓言。弗莱里格拉特曾写下著名的诗篇《德国是哈姆雷特！》，哈姆雷特是这个未能抓住权力的无用民族的代表。波兰人亦是如此。在19世纪时，波兰正被从地图上抹去，对波兰人而言，“这里有一个年轻人，被疏离，对政府感到愤怒，不断上演聪明的剧目，使当局感到不安。他应该继承过去伟大的皇家国王，他是我们的标志。”所以它对各地的政治异见人士而言是一部非常重要的戏剧。

Michael Dobson: The other problem with reading Hamlet is all about psychology rather than perhaps about consciousness or about somebody who feels, who communicates theatrically what it actually feels like to be alive and to be in trouble, is the fact that Hamlets are all different.You read a novel, you read the same novel. You've got the same evidence in front of you to deduce who Pip is or whoever it may be. Hamlets change. Different productions do different scripts. They move speeches like Hamlet does, and it'll fit an extraordinary range of actors. As long as you can just about hold a sword, you can play Hamlet, as long as you're really good at relating to audiences. 

迈克尔·多布森：阅读《哈姆雷特》的另一个问题是关于心理学的，而不是关于意识。或者说，是关于人以戏剧化的方式表达活着和陷入困境的实际感觉，这就是为什么每一出《哈姆雷特》都不尽相同。读小说时，读者阅读同一本小说，可以看到同样的证据来推断结论。但哈姆雷特一直在变。每一次演出的剧本都不同。他们像哈姆雷特一样改变演说的位置，以适合各种不同类型的演员。只要你能握住一把剑，只要你擅长与观众共情，你就能扮演哈姆雷特。

Michael Dobson: I mean, most people think of Hamlet as young and lean and elegant as the great young man's coming of age as an actor part, but I mean, Simon Russell Beale was a wonderful Hamlet, and he was sort of verging on middle age, and he's to be candid, quite dumpy. He's not an athletic actor, he's a very strong actor and a very musical actor, an incredibly eloquent actor. But he's not Errol Flynn or the young Olivier who does that huge jump in his film version in 1948 just to show that he can. And Ben Kingsley was a sort of Beckettian Hamlet in big boots and a coat in his little studio production. It was wonderfully kind of absurdist. It's a very pliable play because it's so kind of loose at its seams. You can give just the iconic moments and do what you like, or you can give just the iconic moments.

迈克尔·多布森：大多数人认为哈姆雷特和优秀的成年演员一样，是年轻的、精干的、优雅的。但我想说，西蒙·拉塞尔·比尔是一名出色的哈姆雷特扮演者，他年近半百，坦率地说，他是相当笨重的。他不是一名健美的演员，他是一名非常强壮的、乐感好的演员，拥有令人难以置信的口才。但他不是埃罗尔·弗林，也不是年轻的劳伦斯·奥利佛。奥利佛在1948年电影版《哈姆雷特》中完成了一个高难度的起跳动作，只是为了展示他有这个能力。本·金斯利在他的小工作室制作版本中，则是穿着大靴子和大衣的贝克特式哈姆雷特。那是一种奇妙的荒诞主义。这是一部可塑性很强的戏剧，因为它的连接非常松散。你只要演出几个标志性的时刻，其他部分可以随心所欲，甚至你可以只演出标志性的时刻，其他部分都抛去不演。

Michael Dobson: I mean, it's a play that was so popular that when the theatres were closed down in the middle of the 17th century, there was a version done illicitly by actors at fairgrounds and surreptitiously in pubs just called The Grave Makers, which is just the grave digger scene. You know, “We haven't got time to do the whole play before the police come, but here he is! Alas, poor Yorick.” You know, and you just get that kind of edited, emblematic highlight sort of 15 minute good bit of Hamlet as part of your evening's entertainment. 

迈克尔·多布森：这出戏十分受欢迎。在17世纪中叶，剧院被关闭的时期，演员们偷偷摸摸地在酒馆里上演了一个版本，叫做《掘墓人》，只上演掘墓人的片段。“在警察到来之前，我们还没有时间演完整出戏，但警察已经到了。唉，可怜的约里克。” 你可以观看精简后的、具有代表意义的15分钟《哈姆雷特》精华，作为夜晚娱乐消遣的一部分。

Zachary Davis: How else would you characterize the influence of the play across the artistic realms, but maybe even into culture and politics and ordinary life? Where do we see Hamlet?

扎克里·戴维斯：您还会如何归类这部戏对艺术，甚至是对文化、政治和日常生活的影响？我们可以在哪些地方看到《哈姆雷特》的影子？

Michael Dobson: It's a play that offers the temptation of solipsism. It's a play that comes to people's minds when they are unburdening themselves and when they're writing a literary text that is all about somebody who feels they're special where you're trying to get into their minds. Tristram Shandy, which is the mad autobiography of somebody who's obsessed with his parents' sex life and various other things. Goethe’s The Sorrows of Young Werther, this suicidal, fashionable, sensitive student who is so upset about Charlotte that eventually he wears a green waistcoat and shoots himself. I mean, admittedly, it's a green waistcoat rather than black, but that kind of romantic suicide cult, “I'm so melancholy and sensitive. I'm too good for this world. I have a secret sorrow.” Those people are forever quoting Hamlet. 

迈克尔·多布森：这也是一出展现唯我论吸引力的剧目。当人们卸下包袱，当人们创作的文学作品都是关于某个自认为特别的人，而你又试图去理解他们的思想时，这部剧目会浮现在人们的脑海之中。《项狄传》是一部疯狂的自传，他对父母的性生活和其他各种事情都很着迷。歌德的《少年维特的烦恼》中，那个有自杀倾向的、时髦的、敏感的学生，为夏洛特伤透了心，最终他穿上了一件绿色马甲并开枪自杀。诚然，这是一件绿色马甲，而不是黑色的，但那种浪漫的自杀崇拜，“我是如此忧郁和敏感。我对这个世界而言太优秀了。我有一个秘密的烦恼。”他们一直都在引用《哈姆雷特》。

Michael Dobson: The game continues. I mean, Ian McEwan has published Nutshell, which is Hamlet all done as a soliloquy by Hamlet when he's still an embryo.

迈克尔·多布森：这个现象还在持续。伊恩·麦克尤恩已经出版的《坚果壳》，便是由胚胎时期的哈姆雷特以独白的形式完成的《哈姆雷特》。

Michael Dobson: It's a very useful text for opening things up and if you decide that what matters, you're not going to talk about social relations, I mean, Hamlet does, of course, but for writers who think that the important thing is consciousness on rendering how special somebody is as an individual and how special their perspective on the world is, regardless of how the world is organized or what their place in it materially happens to be, then Hamlet is one way in. You produce a middle class Hamlet or some kind of local Hamlet. It's a play that falls open for you quite readily.

迈克尔·多布森：如果你决定了什么是重要的，你不打算谈论社会关系，这是非常有用的开放性的文本，当然《哈姆雷特》确实谈论了这个话题，但某些作者认为重要的是渲染个体特殊性，渲染个体世界观的特殊性，无论这个世界是如何构成的，或他们处于世界里的哪个位置，那《哈姆雷特》是一个方法。你可以塑造一版中产阶级的《哈姆雷特》，或一些地区性的《哈姆雷特》。这部剧始终保持开放性。

Zachary Davis: Hamlet is a play that gets to the heart of what motivates all of us to act; love, betrayal, grief, and family. Shakespeare places us inside the mind of Hamlet, to see how he personally wrestles with these forces. It is a work of deep psychological complexity, and has inspired many writers to explore and reveal the inner lives of their characters. Part of what keeps Hamlet alive is its delicate balance of textured specificity and capacious vagueness. It is specific enough for Hamlet to feel real while also inviting endless interpretations. 

扎克里·戴维斯：《哈姆雷特》这出戏剧直指所有人行为动机的核心：爱、背叛、悲伤和家庭。莎士比亚带我们走进哈姆雷特的内心世界，看他如何与这些力量进行个人斗争。这是一部具有深刻心理复杂性的作品，启发了许多作家探索和揭示笔下角色的内心世界。让《哈姆雷特》保持活力的部分原因是它在有质感的具体性和宽泛的模糊性之间保持了微妙平衡。这部作品足够具体，让我们可以感受到《哈姆雷特》的真实，但也引发了无穷的解读。

Michael Dobson: Hamlet showed that the theatre can let you feel what it's like to be alive as someone else in the presence of death and melodrama and terror. It's a play about emotional instability that suddenly opened up whole worlds of inner experience for collective discussion by whole audiences at a time and whole cultures at a time. It starts with a ghost, it becomes a ghost. We're all haunted by Hamlet, whether we've read it, or seen it, or acted it, or not. It's not going to go away.

迈克尔·多布森：《哈姆雷特》表明，戏剧可以让你感受到他人在死亡、戏剧性场面和恐怖面前的感受。这是一部关于情绪不稳定的戏剧，它突然开启了内心体验的新世界，让所有观众和不同文化在同一时间参与集体讨论。整部戏由一个鬼魂开始，自身也成为一个鬼魂。我们都被《哈姆雷特》的鬼魂缠绕着，无论我们是否读过它，看过它，或演过它，它是不会消失的。

Zachary Davis: Writ Large is a production of Ximalaya. Writ Large is produced by Jack Pombriant, and me, Zachary Davis. Script editing is by Galen Beebe. We get help from Feiran Du, Ariel Liu, and Monica Zhang. Our theme song is by Ian Coss. Don’t miss an episode. Subscribe today in the Ximalaya app. Thanks for listening. See you next time.

扎卡里·戴维斯：本节目由喜马拉雅独家制作播出。感谢您的收听！